Duncan Wardle has a question about your company. Actually, he has a lot of them, but perhaps this one is the most consequential: Are you a “no, because” company or a “yes, and” company?
Because the difference between the two for the man who spent 30 years as the head of innovation and creativity at Disney is significant. And it just might be the core of a company’s culture.
“We say the biggest barrier in innovation is, ‘I don’t have time to think,’” Wardle tells Karen Webster. “That’s not true. The biggest barrier to innovation is our own river of thinking.
“Well, what’s a river of thinking? It’s our own experience and our expertise. And the more time in which we have in the banking and finance industry, the faster, the wider, the deeper the river is.
“But guess what? In the last four years, we had a global pandemic. We have Gen Z entering the workplace who don’t want to work for you because they believe in purpose, not profit. We’ve got climate change hitting us straight in the face. And oh, here comes AI. We don’t get to think the way we thought four years ago.”
If you’re thinking that this is not your standard interview subject for PYMNTS, you’re right. Wardle has never worked at a bank or FinTech and is not an expert in finance. He has a new book, “The Imagination Emporium: Creative Recipes for Innovation,” due out Dec. 10, which his publisher is positioning as a business book, but he disagrees and we’re with him.
“The Imagination Emporium” is more like a business workbook that tries to unlock disruptive ideas, cultural shifts and out-of-the-box strategies for creating competitive advantage for the long term. That quote about four years ago is a tone-setter for what he sees as an urgent, imperative for reintroducing innovation and creativity for what is a brave new world of “business unusual.”
Wardle talks the talk quickly in a manner that recalls Robin Williams. As he tells Webster, the history of innovation is full of companies that have said “yes, and” while the failures are full of the “no, because” sentiment.
But he also walks the walk. The book is full of tricks, tips and exercises to get to “yes, and.” At Disney he was responsible for several projects, including the outer space journeys of one Buzz Lightyear, among others.
His current journey gets all of his passion, which is substantial. He’s aware that the more cynical among us would say it’s easy to be creative and innovative at a company like Disney, a company whose essence is magic and imagination. But Wardle is quick to dispel this notion. He argues that creativity isn’t about resources; it’s about mindset.
“If resources made you creative, then children would be the least creative people on the planet,” he says. “They don’t have any resources, yet they’re the most imaginative people you’ll ever meet.”
Wardle’s message to those in heavily regulated industries, such as banking or healthcare, is equally direct: Creativity thrives in constraints.
He explains how tools like “What If” allow teams to metaphorically break every rule in their industry and spark fresh ideas. Using Walt Disney’s “Fantasia” as an example, he recounts how challenging theatrical norms led to innovations that redefined the movie-going experience. For Wardle, excuses about resources or regulations are just barriers in the mind.
Wardle invokes Einstein’s famous declaration that “imagination is more important than knowledge” as a guiding principle. He points out that knowledge, while valuable, often creates boundaries. “Knowledge gets in the way,” he says, arguing that expertise and past experiences form that “river of thinking” that limits our ability to see new possibilities.
The tools in “The Imagination Emporium” are designed to get people out of that river. Wardle highlights Disney’s use of rephrasing to shift perspectives. By calling park visitors “guests” and employees “cast members,” Disney created a culture of hospitality that became intrinsic to the brand. Simple changes in language or framing can lead to groundbreaking shifts in approach, allowing imagination to flourish where knowledge might have stifled it.
Wardle knows the corporate reflex to say “no, because” all too well. It’s the phrase that shuts down ideas before they’ve had a chance to grow. In one exercise, he demonstrates the stark contrast between “no, because” and “yes, and.” Ideas that began as small sparks became expansive, multilayered concepts when built upon collaboratively. “You can always value-engineer a big idea down,” Wardle tells Webster, “but you can’t take a small idea and make it big.”
He suggests creating physical spaces — like Disney’s Greenhouse — where “no, because” is banned. These designated zones foster a culture of openness and possibility, where ideas can bloom without the immediate threat of judgment.
Great ideas rarely come during office hours, Wardle observes. Instead, they strike when you’re in the shower, running, or doing something mundane. The reason? Your brain shifts from “busy beta,” a conscious, high-alert state, to a more relaxed, subconscious state where creativity thrives.
To replicate this environment at work, Wardle advocates for “energizers” — short exercises designed to break the beta state and open the door to the subconscious mind. He emphasizes the importance of laughter and playfulness, even in professional settings, as tools to unlock the creativity hidden in the subconscious.
Wardle acknowledges that the road to innovation is often fraught with resistance and unforeseen obstacles. He recalls pitching the idea of sending Buzz Lightyear into space, an audacious concept that faced intense scrutiny from NASA. Some NASA officials were thrilled; others were staunchly opposed. Yet Wardle persisted, knowing that the story of Buzz’s dream to fly would resonate far beyond the Disney brand.
Ultimately, the collaboration succeeded, culminating in Buzz Lightyear’s journey aboard the International Space Station. Wardle emphasizes that bravery and persistence are crucial. “Whether you think you can or think you can’t, you’re probably right,” he says, quoting Henry Ford.
For Wardle, the ultimate failure isn’t an unachieved KPI or a missed deadline — it’s a book gathering dust. “If it’s on the bookshelf, send it back to me. I’ll give you your money back,” he says. Each chapter is designed to be immediately actionable, filled with exercises that invite readers to think differently. For Wardle, success means his ideas are used, not shelved. As he puts it, “It’s about creating a culture where creativity isn’t an event — it’s a habit.”